Expert predicts broadband cost blowout
Updated
The NBN is expected to be completed by 2018, with centres connected as the project progresses. (www.sxc.hu: Steve Woods)
There are claims the cost of the $43 billion National Broadband Network (NBN) could double.
Experienced industry consultant and project manager Malcolm McKenzie has told Radio National's Background Briefing program the costs of big telecommunication rollouts always blow out.
The claim comes as the Federal Government prepares to announce that more than 300,000 extra premises will be connected to the NBN than originally planned.
"I would say for any project this size, [a cost blowout of] 50 per cent to 100 per cent would not be unrealistic," Mr McKenzie said.
He says red tape and rain are just two issues that will cause delays.
But NBN chief Mike Quigley says the Tasmanian trial, which is about to be launched, came in on time and on budget.
"I would be surprised if, as we move forward, we didn't get in fact better," Mr Quigley said.
He says the NBN's business plan shows the network will turn a profit. The business plan is not public.
Mr Quigley says it uses more pessimistic assumptions than a major consultant's report commissioned by the Federal Government.
"What I would say, and I'm not going to go into details of those differences in the assumptions other than to say we came to the same general conclusion that an acceptable return could be generated for the government," he said.
"Our business case demonstrates that quite clearly and our assumptions are probably in some cases more conservative."
Coverage maps
Meanwhile, NBN coverage maps released by the Government show the network will provide fibre optic coverage to 93 per cent of residences, up from its original estimate of 90 per cent.
Communications Minister Stephen Conroy says the extra coverage can be achieved within budget.
"Every home will be connected to the National Broadband Network," he told AM.
"There will be the 93 per cent fibre to the home footprint. There will be the 4 per cent wireless, the next generation of wireless footprint and the remaining 3 per cent will be the satellite footprint."
Regional centres including Weipa, Tennant Creek, Port Augusta, Albany, Cooma, and Warrnambool will be included in the fibre optic network, with the remaining 7 per cent of residences connected through wireless and satellite networks.
Residents serviced by the fibre optic network will have access to internet speeds of 100 megabits per second, while those on wireless and satellite services will receive connections speeds of 12 megabits per second.
At present Australia's average internet speed in 2.6 megabits per second.
The NBN represents a major point of difference between the two major parties in the election campaign, with the Federal Opposition planning on scrapping the network if elected.
Opposition communications spokesman Tony Smith has accused the Government of reckless spending.
"This is $43 billion of taxpayers' money that the Government's prepared to punt," he told AM.
"We'll be outlining our plan in the not too distant future but we won't be spending anything like Labor."
The network is expected to be completed by 2018, with centres connected as the project progresses.
Background Briefing's report can be heard on Sunday on Radio National after the news at 9:00am.
First posted
Comments (102)
Comments for this story are closed, but you can still have your say.
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ABC (Moderator):
30 Jul 2010 7:28:48am
Do you think the party that wins the election should push ahead with the NBN?
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WMA:
30 Jul 2010 7:48:22am
The NBN is a critical piece of enabling infrastructure that will becomes the backbone of twenty first century Australia. People always talk about how they don't need it now, but ignore or are ignorant of its capabilities and importance going forward.
Agree (18) Alert moderator
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Stranded:
30 Jul 2010 8:29:14am
What a crock! This is CLASSIC Labor "Perception management". It will NOT revolutionised your life. Labor has ben hoodwinked by Cisco Systems.
Labor said the same thing about the Collins Class subs. Nice one, Beazley !
NBN is a uncosted, non scrutinised Labor thought bubble. It will end up costing this country unrecoverable BILLIONS.
EVERY international FTTH project looses money.
It may have application to business or to commerical estates .. but building this infrastructure to allow kids to download music fastter is a CROCK.
There are better ways. But Labor never listens.Agree (8) Alert moderator
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Arrow:
30 Jul 2010 9:13:59am
The NBN is not just important, it is also an investment that will boost productivity and help small business.
Yes it's expensive, but like any good investment it will pay itself off over time.
We are so far behind other developed countries in this regard.
Delaying or putting in a cheap model would NOT be smart.Agree (3) Alert moderator
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M:
30 Jul 2010 9:20:21am
The NBN is the Snowy Mountains Scheme of our decade. It will provide great infrastructure for years to come. Unlike some of the other Labor spending I completely support the NBN and think it's incredibly short-sighted of the Libs to oppose this because it costs money.
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Truedisbeliever:
30 Jul 2010 9:26:50am
Labor's ultimate in pork barrelling exercise (AKA the NBN) will be obsolete in 5 minutes and we will have an $86 Billion dollar white elephant.
If private enterprise needs fast broadband to be competitive then private enterprise will fund it. NOT the taxpayer.
Since when has Labor wanted Aust to be competitive? Labor rolled back IR reform, Labor wants to bury mining companies with higher taxes, Labor wants to lump everyone with carbon taxes and an ETS, Labor policy wants to retard successful business and reward failure.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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bj:
30 Jul 2010 9:54:23am
If you knew anything about telecommunications you'd know that the capital cities are swimming in fibre optic cable sufficient to deliver super fast broadband now.
That cable has been in place for 10 years and it's 'dark'. In other words, its unused, even by business, which would supposedly be the big user of the NBN's services.
What does that tell you about the demand for super-fast broadband?Agree (1) Alert moderator
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charlie:
30 Jul 2010 7:50:31am
Sure they can push ahead with an information highway, but I would also like to travel faster than 50kph on the national highway, and maybe a fast train service wouldn't go astray either. Computers are good but you can't shift goods and people across the country with them.
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Eric:
30 Jul 2010 8:17:00am
While you are right that you cannot shift goods and people accross the country with computers, it is also thru that the need for people to travel accross the country will be less. Really, all those people going into the office daily shouldn't have to do that everyday. With good and fast communication methods it is very well possible to work from home more often.
That said, I work from home for quite a while now and I must say that with current broadband speeds it already works very good.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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El Guapo:
30 Jul 2010 9:15:24am
"That said, I work from home for quite a while now and I must say that with current broadband speeds it already works very good."
You miss the point here...the way we use the internet now is not the same as how we will use it 5 or 10 year from now or how it was used 5 years ago. Just because you are happy now does not mean you are going to be happy 5 years from now, when you realize that overseas they can do much more than just recieve emails and download files.
The NBN is a more efficient way of communicating and sharing information. It is an investment in the future. The problem here is that the goverment has not being able to articulate the benefits of such a project well.
Also transport is a state goverment problem not a federal goverment. So if you want to comaplain about it hit up your state parliament rep.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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DannyW:
30 Jul 2010 9:55:40am
El Guapo, what is it exactly that overseas countries can do so much more of that we do here in Australia with the internet? I'm curious to know what other countries are doing that we currently can't?
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PJ:
30 Jul 2010 9:56:05am
Actually you miss the point.
Given the speed of changing technologies, in all probabilities, in 5 to 10 years time the NBN will be obsolete and we will still be operating internet speeds slower than the rest of the world.
If it was going to be so good for business, why isn't buisiness funding the network?
Surely, there are better ways to spend our taxpayer dollars.Agree (2) Alert moderator
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japius:
30 Jul 2010 8:35:08am
They need to state exactly what the cost will be to the end user, stop saying "the isps will decide" I currently get 200gb for $79 a month and connect at 14mbps which is more than fast enough for everything I do and my included data means I dont have to worry about shaping or excess useage because I never go even close to that.
So what will I pay per month on the NBN for 200gb at any speed >14mbps? I have heard nothign to suggest I will be better off, in fact worse off under some rumours.
Why not spend the 40 - 80 BILLION on getting top notch ADSL2 to all major areas and good wireless to country areas where it only effects a handful of people in any one area.
And dump the filter!Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Jovial Monk:
30 Jul 2010 9:14:29am
Because a LOT of people cannot get ADSL because of "pair gain" because Telstra has not looked after its network.
The NBN will allow data, phone and fax through a single connection. In Tassie $49 a month 35mbps connection with no real cap are already being offered and have been taken up by 45% of people in the areas so far connected.
All this without the new services the NBN will make possible, like TV over IP.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Stranded:
30 Jul 2010 9:36:52am
Is that the copper network that Gillard will pay $11 billion dollars for ???
Hahahahaahahah .... the ALP are a JOKE !Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Arrow:
30 Jul 2010 9:16:16am
Japius - the experience in other countries has been that costs come DOWN when internet is improved, because more people - and increasing numbers of businesses - sign up when the service is better.
Same as building a railway is expensive, but over time the cost of transporting goods comes down dramatically.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Chris W:
30 Jul 2010 9:19:19am
On major ISP is offering 200GB @ 25Mbps/2Mbps at $109 on the NBN test areas already operating ($139 at 100Mbps). This is the slowest service currently being offered to ISPs by the NBN. These costs will stay reasonably high until the NBN is more broadly deployed because all that data still has to go over data channels being paid for at current rates.
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Stranded:
30 Jul 2010 9:38:55am
Sure ... you keep believeing that.
Just like other Labor controlled utilites like Power and Water ... always getting cheaper.
You Labor voters really do live in a dream land !
I suppose you also believe in the "Light on the Hill" and other fairy tales ?Agree (1) Alert moderator
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NPB:
30 Jul 2010 9:30:38am
14mbps might be good enough for current generation applications, just like dial up would have been sufficient years ago. It wont be long before services and applications arrive which require much higher bandwidth.. It is cost effective and long term thinking to go for maximum bandwidth now..
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Budovski:
30 Jul 2010 9:32:47am
They have already released some preliminary costs and they were around $50 a month for an average plan. Thats half what I pay now for 10 times the speed.
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the yank:
30 Jul 2010 8:39:22am
Without the shaddow of a doubt. Unless of course we want to stay in the 20th century while the rest of the world dare I say moves forward.
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Tony:
30 Jul 2010 8:52:06am
When Tony Abbot wins this election he has said he will cancel the NBN and save us all a lot of money and save us from the spendathon of the Labor idiots who have stuffed up everything they have got involved with.
They (the Labor party) have proven them selves to be irresponsible financial managers and if you all want higher interest rates and a bigger deficit (Labor have never had a surplus) go for silly Gilly, however there is a more responsible choice. When times are tight we all have to tighten our purse strings.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Damian:
30 Jul 2010 9:11:20am
And what will Abbott put in the NBNs place? Bike couriers?
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the yank:
30 Jul 2010 9:35:38am
Yep lets let Telstra keep on failing to bring us leading edge tech. like Howard intended.
Heck with advanced technologies we might actually learn what the rest of thw orld is doing.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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viditor:
30 Jul 2010 9:36:42am
It's obvious that the Liberals are regressing to the times of Richard Alston (the greatest Luddite of them all).
To quote Opposition spokesman Ian McFarlane when speaking on the NBN, "People don't need those sorts of speeds to operate their internet".
This is sad...it says that not only do we need better education for our children, but for our ministers as well.
It must be government and not private enterprise that builds the NBN.
1. The largest source of revenue triggered by the NBN will be the taxes generated from the GDP increases it stimulates. That is not an incentive for a private company.
2. We have seen that privatised monopolies cause increase costs to business and consumers.
3. None of the goals put forth for the sale of Telstra have been achieved...it has turned out to be a very bad idea.Agree (2) Alert moderator
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LeightonJ:
30 Jul 2010 9:28:07am
The NBN is a critical piece of infrastructure for the future. Its as important as electricity, the clean water systems and the phone network.
Imagine - if we had not invested in these things where would we be today?
Of course we can't see the whole picture from where we are because we can't predict the future but the need for speed is critical. Mobile won't cut it as the main pipe but will be great for mobile use.
Liberals need to get on the programme.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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MH.:
30 Jul 2010 9:29:32am
Absolutely. We're already behind the rest of the western world with our I.T. Snails-pace broadband is simply not good enough in the twenty first century.
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Dane:
30 Jul 2010 9:40:13am
Yes. I don't know why the coalition want to drop it... wait, yes I do, but everyone else has already said why. If they wanted to win a point they could come up with a way to make it cheaper and still achieve the end result. Isn't finance their niche? Or is their solution to just cut things and hope it works out for the best?
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Lewis of The Hills:
30 Jul 2010 9:54:02am
As I understand it, the massive cost escalation is in the fibre-to-the-home delivery. The original high speed broadband concept of fibre-to-the-node delivery was only under $5 billion.
Whoever wins will proceed with a high speed broadband network built & owned by the taxpayer but the difference between the two parties' policy reflects their core ideologies. The Libs believe that individual homes & businesses should pay for their connection to the network. Labor wants the taxpayer to pay for everything.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Schnappi:
30 Jul 2010 7:36:00am
Absolutely, irregardless of the cost,I think it is criminal to even think of scrapping it.
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Johnny:
30 Jul 2010 7:51:43am
No. It is criminal to consider spending 40 to 80 billion dollars on a project that has been planned and costed on post-it note. By all means infrastructure should be improved but there should be some due diligence and proper costing and clear need identified. People want fast faster Internet, fair enough, but this a NBN not a IBN so the gain for joe average is certainly not worth the ridiculous cost.
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Arrow:
30 Jul 2010 9:17:54am
Johnny - I'm satisfied that the costing and planning has been done properly.
Critics will always say "it can't be done" or "I don't believe it".
Personally I say - "we need it - let's roll our sleeves up and build it."Agree (1) Alert moderator
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viditor:
30 Jul 2010 9:40:03am
The World Bank has stated that pulling out of the NBN would be an economic disaster for Australia.
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Jason Smith:
30 Jul 2010 7:36:35am
The only people that don't are the old farts still scared of what they don't / won't understand.
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seajae:
30 Jul 2010 8:44:07am
i am one of those old farts and you are way off the mark. All you see is your gaming and downloading speeds going up, try looking at it from everyone else perspective, we do need improvement but at what cost to the consumers. This has more to do with what is acceptable than anything else, it was made up overnight by a group of 4, no figures have been released to back it only talk. After all the stuff ups with every other program they have instigated so far how good do you really think this one is, it will stuff up just like the others because it was a rushed release to gain voter approval with no background checks what so ever.
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Rod.:
30 Jul 2010 9:28:58am
At least it has to start somewhere.. nothing comes from brainless thought bubbles... eh tony?
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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NPB:
30 Jul 2010 9:32:14am
Increase is speed will also improve access to services, health, aged care, etc...
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Heinkel:
30 Jul 2010 7:48:30am
Yes definately. Currently travelling in Europe even in small coastal villages the download rates are far in excess of those I experience in metropolitan Melbourne.
Nation building is what Government spending should be about and so far this is the only real project by any party in the last 15 years. I have had enough of the middle class welfare and tax cuts of the Howard years. While not entirely convinced about Labour I'm quiet prepared to let them have another term because I'm firmly convinced from Mr Abbotts comments that voting for him and the Liberals would be a return to a do nothing scenario.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Horrocks:
30 Jul 2010 8:20:33am
well I'll get into my armour suit first, but what is the big deal about this, the internet is quick enough now, why does it need to be any faster, it is more important that we have hospitals that work and staff to put in them then some body being able to download the latest game or movie and the way this government manages things they are the last people that should be given the responsibility of implementing and running this thing
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James:
30 Jul 2010 8:58:13am
Advances in computers and robotics mean that increased communication is necessary. With higher speed internet, remote hospitals will actually have access to more and better staff, particularly specialists.
For example, there are robots operating in hospitals that allow a highly trained surgeon to perform the surgery from a different continent. While I'll admit that this will be far from the reality for the majority of remote Australian hospitals, at the moment it is practically impossible.
Other medical benefits could include connectivity between hospitals for medical record transfers. If you normally visit a doctor in Melbourne, and hit your head on a rock in the Grampians, the paramedics and doctors could get your records to identify if you have allergies to certain anaesthetics and give you much better treatment (subject to some form of privacy regulations I suspect)..Agree (2) Alert moderator
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pj:
30 Jul 2010 9:18:35am
Completely agree. There is so much more to internetworked communciation than browsing the ABC web site and downloading mp3s.
The health industry is one example, but also better and more stable video conferencing for businesses therefore cutting down on expenditure for things such as travel is another example and there are literally hundreds more where greater internet speeds are neccessary as the complexity of data pushes up file sizes and the like as greater technologies become available.
Interestingly, watching an interview with the Opposition spokesperson (couln't remember his name), he was asked very directly does the Oppositions plan use inferior technology. The answer was a mixture of posturing and delay tactics saying the details will come out later in the campaign. You would think that if the Opposition's technology was superior, and they knew it, they would give an emphatic "yes" to the question, rather than just dodging it and posturing. I cannot blindly say that I support the Opposition's plan before I see the detail just on the basis that it's not the NBN....Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Tomokatu:
30 Jul 2010 9:00:43am
Horrocks complained:-
"...it is more important that we have hospitals that work ..."
With a full-speed broadband connection, your brain surgeon in Melbourne could operate on you in Broome.
That's a "hospital that works".Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Matt:
30 Jul 2010 9:13:57am
You do realise that building something like the NBN will help reduce load on our hospitals. Patients who are less critical will be able to moved home and monitored much more successfully remotely. Top surgeons will be able to perform remote diagnosis / operations on patients, etc (plenty of ways i'm sure people haven't even thought of yet).
All those who think it would only be used for movies and games need to think outside the box. It will reduce congestion on our already overcrowded roads, if people are able to work from home more effectively. It will change the way students at all levels learn and interact with each other. It's also likely to change our lives in ways people haven't even thought of yet.
This should be Labor's major campaign item - it's the only major differentiator between the parties. A decent piece of nation building infrastructure, rather than lining the pockets of the "aussie battlers".Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Arrow:
30 Jul 2010 9:22:34am
Horrocks - the benefits of fast workable internet are already demonstrated in dozens of countries overseas.
Medicine, business productivity, banking, education services all improve massively.
Sure home entertainment is a nice bonus too, but it isn't the main driver.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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pangloss:
30 Jul 2010 7:53:11am
If the ALP had any brains they would run with the NBN as their lead policy, it is essential for our country to compete internationally and has widespread support. The coalition are trogs on this issue.
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bj:
30 Jul 2010 8:08:02am
If the Coalition had any brains it would run opposition to the NBN as its key policy, particularly with the likes of Lindsay Tanner saying that a financial return of 6-7% would be acceptable (can't Labor find anyone with knowledge about basic finance to fill the Finance Porfolio?)
Labor has not and cannot produce a business case supporting this 'investment'.Agree (2) Alert moderator
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pj:
30 Jul 2010 9:54:00am
The minute they do that without an alternative, they lose the election.
Simple.
Every single focus group would come out against them. The Australian Chamber of Commerce, The Australian Industry Group, the Australian Medical Association, the Australian Association of Small Business and many, many more have come out in public support of faster broadband, many of them have stated they want the NBN.
There was no business modeling with the run out of telegraph lines, or the national raod system, or the electrcity lines but I can't find anyone today who would say that such spending was a bad idea (keeping in mind that there was little or no profit in the early days of telecommunications and electricity provision).
If a ROI of 6-7% is a super-profit in the mining industry, and an acceptable return in most investment markets, why is not acceptable on a major infrastructure project?
Also, Tanner has a double degree in Laws/Arts so he's hardly a fool.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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DNSFilterWontWork:
30 Jul 2010 8:21:25am
They cant run NBN as their main policy as they have disenfranchised the voters this would appeal to with a filter that will be ineffective at protecting people like they claim it will: but will collaterally censor other parts of the net and slow the NBN to a crawl. No point halving the time it takes to download a website if your filter introduces a huge lag before it starts.
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Titto:
30 Jul 2010 7:53:22am
I live 54km from Brisbane and the only broadband I have access to is a very congested, 1500/256 Telstra ADSL1 regional connection. I live in a mobile dead spot, so no NEXTG is available. I don't even have access to the 8000/384 service that Telstra offers just about everywhere else via ADSL1.
So, I'm not taking any chances, I'm voting for the party that supports the NBN, but is against the mandatory filter, The Greens.Agree (3) Alert moderator
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Taust:
30 Jul 2010 7:58:19am
Whilst the promised land may give a return to Government what will be the cost to the consumer? Remember what we paid for telephone calls (particularly overseas calls) before privatisation hit the telephone industry.
If some people want superfast broadband to do magic things why do they not pay for it themselves and leave the rest of us to spend our money how we want to?Agree (0) Alert moderator
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DanofMelb:
30 Jul 2010 8:13:16am
I also remember when we had fibre roll outs for pay TV and as a side I had fibre installed for my internet.
It was uncapped, unlimited and cost me 80$ a month. Then ADSL was engineered and fibre suddenly became a premium technology and an artifical pricing structure fell over the whole industry as corporate interests acknowledged the future and sought to profiteer from it.
So instead of crappy copper and awesome fibre, we now have crappy copper, moderate ADSL and awesome fibre. Privatisation only increases prices of services and creates an illusion of choice. The various 'tiers' of service you can buy is an artifical market and we 'could' all be on fibre however opportunistic capital has possessed the industry.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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James:
30 Jul 2010 8:16:56am
Because some of us who want super-fast broadband cannot get it. Regardless of cost.
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Horrocks:
30 Jul 2010 8:46:29am
by why do you want it, what will it achieve, you can't send cargo with it, you can't wipe peoples bum's and noses with it while they are sick in hospital, you can't create extra nurses or doctors with it, what is th point of superfast broadband apart from being able to download music, games and videos with it.
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StaggerLee:
30 Jul 2010 9:17:18am
This is a piece of infrastructure/tech. capital that must be in place asap.
The social and economic implications of this technology are enormous.......little in our society - "sending cargo", "hospital care" and whatever else you can think of, will remain untouched.
Movie/music downloads are at the bottom end of its purposes.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Bollocks:
30 Jul 2010 9:32:18am
"what is th point of superfast broadband apart from being able to download music, games and videos with it."
How about live streaming in a hospital theatre with a true 1:1 real time aspect ?
How about remote areas given the ability to see friends and family in real time as well ?
How about that cargo you speak of being sent at the push of a button without time delay due to congested adsl lines ?
Because the government really wants the NBN so people can download fast movies and play games....
Open your eyes to the bigger picture.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Horrocks:
30 Jul 2010 8:22:47am
hear hear, why should taxpayers money be wasted just so people can download the latest games and movies at a record speed, be patient, there is more to life than movies and games
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Tomokatu:
30 Jul 2010 9:04:05am
You're fixated on "games & movies".
We can't know what we'll use it for yet, the jobs that it will need haven't been invented yet, but that's just the same as the proliferation of the telephone system.
The jobs that were around fifty years after it started weren't thought of when it began.
But if we don't have it, we can't do those jobs.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Arrow:
30 Jul 2010 9:23:39am
There was once a time when people thought that no human would ever need to travel faster than 30mph (the speed of trains at the time).
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M:
30 Jul 2010 9:35:29am
If all you think of is movies and games then you're missing the point.
Business is going to be the number one user of the NBN.
All your comments about spending on health have ignored that if we get the online medical records also proposed by Labor then doctors need some way to access them quickly.
Education will also benefit. The world wide web was created for sharing research and is still used for that.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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DanofMelb:
30 Jul 2010 8:00:27am
NBN is like roads - it's a neccessary infrastructure required for the next-gen business' to transfer their services across.
I am stunned the Liberals have taken such a position on the NBN as it states to the youth of Australia "WE clearly have no idea about the nations ambitions".
They (libs) have lost votes as a result of opposing the NBN. It (NBN) should not even be a part of the election debate/tussle.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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rob1966:
30 Jul 2010 8:30:49am
To be fair, the Libs are not against an NBN per se, rather their position is that the Government should not fund it - the user should.
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mike:
30 Jul 2010 8:52:36am
Which is to say it will never happen - who can pay $1000 p/m for an internet connection? If you do your research almost all infratructure is built by governments or a combination of governmnet/private because of the initial costs involved.
Yes, the Liberals are against it but not because they don't believe in it. It's just the easiest way for them to make themselfs appear more economicaly responable - AT ANY COST TO OUR NATION.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Dad:
30 Jul 2010 9:59:09am
So if you are saying $1000 to get superfast BB is too much for an individual why is it OK for EVERY Australian to pay $2000+. That's what the NBN will cost. The government is spending money on your behalf and we all have to pay via taxation. Then users will pay $1000+ a year to use it. Does that sound like good value?
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Lou:
30 Jul 2010 9:05:58am
Which just goes to show that the Liberals have put ideology before good policy, and how badly they have underestimated the importance of the NBN as a piece of vital infrastructure, which simply won't happen without government leadership and investment. If the Liberals were serious they would find a way to make this project happen AND recoup costs from users. Of course it is actually legitimate to share the costs of this project across all citizens, through the taxes we pay, since we will all share the benefits of a more efficient and productive economy. The NBN should be the key issue of the election campaign.
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Bruno:
30 Jul 2010 8:02:03am
This is essential if Australia is to 'move forward' on technology, work and leisure. Wireless wont cut it in any form. NBN will allow the decentralization of work and take pressure off capital cities. It is one of those issues that needs to happen at whatever the cost because we cannot afford it not to happen. The roll out of the coper network was expensive across Australia all those years ago. Where would we be if the gov. of the tims said it couldnt afford it? It should have happened when the former Lib gov had $21 billoin in the bank but that was their primary focus, not investing in the Australin people. We should be investing in decenteralised business and residential hubs where commuting to work more tha 1hr away is the extreem not the norm. It will also reduce the carbon footprint. So some investment now to achieve long term goals is essential.
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Herb:
30 Jul 2010 8:05:48am
The expected blowout in costs wouldn't surprise me, going by past performances of governments in this country, along with delays.
It's great that we are talking about 100 megabits per second BUT BY 2018 that's going to be slow with what there's going to be around using intensive data at that time.
Good luck!Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Gomer:
30 Jul 2010 8:06:55am
We should go ahead as we are lagging behind the rest of the world, we need to be more competative and smarter in the way we do things. We have had over 12 years of NO Infrastructure in the country and this is thanks to the liberal party and there middle class welfare.
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Teresa:
30 Jul 2010 8:07:13am
Absolutely.
Try living on a RIM (Telstra's "cheap" alternative to placing an exchange) and downloading the kids homework after 5pm. You may as well start the download and go away for an hour before it's finished.
I'm not talking about having 8000 or 20,000 kilobytes per second for us that's a pipe dream. Speeds that some "rim users" are getting is about about 3 or 4 kilobytes per second during peak times in layman's terms dial-up is faster.
Seriously are we in a 3rd world country with regard to telecommunications. Most of our children are required to do research online, most university's require you to login to collect lecture notes and post assignments.
How about just some pure rest and relaxation after work. With speeds as low as that makes gaming or movie watching on most Xbox's, PS3's or PC's impossible.
I personally take major offense to paying major $$$ for my internet connection and not being able to use it due to poor infrastructure and lack of foresight and planning by the one company (Telstra) that hold's a choke hold monopoly on it.
It's time for technology ignorant people to get themselves either informed or stay out of the debate.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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old fartz smartz:
30 Jul 2010 8:30:40am
Most of us don't need our on-line porn hit any faster than it comes at the moment.
I am on a Telstra next-G dongle in a remote area of Oz and have no trouble with my down-load speed. It's relatively cheap, too.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Teresa:
30 Jul 2010 8:43:44am
"Most of us don't need our on-line porn hit any faster than it comes at the moment."
Excuse me but I take offense to that. I'm a mother who likes to watch the news online after my young children go to bed.
Wirless cheap you have to be kidding. $79.00 for 6gb that in it's self is highway robbery.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Markus:
30 Jul 2010 8:49:51am
If porn is the first thing on your mind that you use the Internet for then I feel a little sorry for you.
Try shifting large(ish) datasets around from place to place ... it is a nightmare. We shouldn't have to be posting dvds in this day and age.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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mike:
30 Jul 2010 8:53:57am
Glad to hear your porn come in fast enough for you but the children who live in remote australia and need education might have a different opinion to yours. Try and think about the "other" Australain's - not just yourself.
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Politically Incorrect:
30 Jul 2010 8:35:42am
I agree, I used to live on a RIM and it was unberable. When you try working from home at 10pm and cant get a stable connection you know that Telstra cant be trusted with the needs of the modern era.
Agree (2) Alert moderator
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Johnno:
30 Jul 2010 8:10:45am
A public $25 million consultancy report says that the figures stack up and some 'expert' disagrees on the basis that these projects 'always cost more'. Well, there's a $25 million saving already. Governments could save a fortune by having costings done on the back of an envelope.
Agree (0) Alert moderator
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rob1966:
30 Jul 2010 8:32:22am
Well, the current Government wrote the business case for the NBN on the back of an envelope - so it's only fair that the costings be done the same way ;)
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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BrucetheAussie:
30 Jul 2010 8:15:22am
The NBN is a hugh waist of public money. People in Australia are not addicted to the internet enough to warrant the need for such a thing. Imagine a time when it would be set up and every one in addicted, then Australians will cease to live their outdoor lives and become even more fat and un healthly. This is not a good thing for the health and wellbeing of Australians. Also its big brother will be able to watch every move as all telephone calls will be made through the NBN. They are paying Telstra with our money to shut down all copper. Please Australia wake up and see what this NBN is trying to do. Anyone who is for shutting it down is for liberty. Go for it Tony Abbott.
Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Eric:
30 Jul 2010 8:36:28am
What a nonsense.
If you want to give people more time to enjoy their outdoor live (or do whatever they want to do with their time), you should embrace the NBN. Good and fast communication methods will give people more freedom to choose from which location they work. Thus avoid spending hours in traffic to and from offices in the city. Ohh and obviously we need to have a bit of an attitude change regarding work from home/work from office buildings.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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shayne:
30 Jul 2010 9:52:59am
Opponents spouted the same resistance to the railways and major road networks, and later the mobile phone networks when they were in their infancy. the infrastructure later proved to be pivotal in the growth of economies providing the population with countless opportunities.
I also think it's expensive and much of the money will probably be wasted as it makes it's way into the pockets of the pollies friends - but in the long term it will be an investment Australia would be wise to make if they're to compete in terms of lifestyle and opportunities with the rest of the world.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Wheelo:
30 Jul 2010 8:16:13am
The elephant in the closet is the fact that in areas with overhead power poles in the street, the NBN will be another thick black Optus like cable further scarring the suburban environment of our suburbs. Labour should make this clear instead of doing pr stunts in trenches every Sunday.
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Alex_D:
30 Jul 2010 8:28:11am
A few years after the election we'll either have:
1. NBN plus intrusive Net censorship and user surveilance, or
2. Slow wireless\satellite bogus "broadband".
Both alternatives are unacceptable.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Dane:
30 Jul 2010 9:38:01am
Think of it this way: a filter can be easily repealed or bypassed.
A national infrastructure project can't.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Pete:
30 Jul 2010 8:34:23am
The national broadband would be fantastic but not at any price. The level of debt currently held by the govt, the uncertainty of EU economies and a prediction that China will slow down its demand are all factors that need consideration.
Has a business case or an economic plan been developed by the government to justify the spend? What will the cost be to the end user? Will the take up be dependant on the price? These questions need to be answered.
It might be that having this facility in business districts is the only viable option. I work from home on a wireless and there is really nothing that i cant do reasonably quickly. I cant download a huge movie in 10 mins, but I can run my business.
The only real benefit is that people will be able to download garbage quicker. How is that going to benefit? As I said earlier, if we had $22billion in the bank and some of the unanswered questions were answered then, sure, great, roll it out. Thats not the case so we need to tread carefully.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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michael (SE Qld):
30 Jul 2010 8:35:49am
As a small business owner who works from home and has their business based in America having fast and reliable Internet is the backbone of my business success. I've waited far too long for Telstra to deliver even reasonable up and download speeds and the NBN is a critical development for not just my business but everyone in the local community (whether they understand it or not)
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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confused:
30 Jul 2010 8:36:04am
So assuming the magic fibre optic cable comes past my house,how much it will it cost and who will be retailing it.Will it be $20 per month or $200 per month, will the cost of downloads be affordable or prohibitive.I would like the answers to these question before I can decide if the NBN is worthy or not.
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Trump:
30 Jul 2010 8:54:31am
I'd only want it done if the Libs are in charge, Labor will either stuff it up or.......stuff it up.
In any case I see more need elsewhere for that money than the need to play games and Tweet at a faster rate.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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gomez:
30 Jul 2010 8:58:02am
abso****lutely.
it is critical that we drag this country out of prehistoric bandwidth - no matter what the cost is.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Mellisa:
30 Jul 2010 9:04:05am
The problem is not whether fast internet is important or not. It's how much it will cost you to use it. Some of the deals being offered at $49 dollars per month are ridiculous.
At the top speed you use up all your month's quota in 2 hours! ... I am not kidding. Have a look at the plans and do the numbers yourself. How much will they charge you over the limit?
The government will slug you as a taxpayer to build it and then again as an individual to use it.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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JanF:
30 Jul 2010 9:06:07am
I have been on Telstra's Fibre Optic network for nearly 10 years and have based my choices of abode on the availablitiy of being able to stay on that cable network. As a small business owner it offers me the ability to communicate face to face with my country clients and reduces their costs and my travel time. As a private individual, I love watching TV from all over the world. I have been one of the lucky few, it is about time the rest of the nation receives access to the rest of the world at speeds taht blow your mind.
Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Shane Pike:
30 Jul 2010 9:10:10am
This "high speed" network is actually far too slow to be future proof. It MUST be at least 1000Mb/s & MUST be capable of multiple Gb/s speed upgrades to be future proof. Japan already have gigabit internet (1000Mb/s), so this network will be way too slow to be competitive. 100 Mb/s will be obsolete even before this "high speed network" is rolled out. That's what happens when we have non-technical people running the show. Conroy hasn't got a clue. And neither do the "experts" that he relies on.
Agree (3) Alert moderator
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Peter:
30 Jul 2010 9:29:21am
Given that they're laying fibre, the network is certainly upgradable to multi-gigabit speeds. The connecting hardware can be replaced as demand for speed increases. They won't need to relay the fibre. The speed of light will not be a limiting factor in this equation. I'd say that the experts may have got that bit right...
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Simon:
30 Jul 2010 9:26:25am
Just go onto ISP web sites and the pricing for NBN plans is all there in black and white. For example Internode 15GB @ 25Mbps = $29.95 a month.
Thats cheaper than I can get 1.5Mbps where I live.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Peter:
30 Jul 2010 9:27:02am
The NBN is vital and not for people to download things (or rather, not simply). 100Mb allows interoffice communication at the same speed as connecting to your local server at work. It will allow interactive online courses to be delivered to remote students with full two-way video to teachers. It will allow realtime monitoring of patients and medical by specialists across the country. It will allow small business to develop and compete without having to spend millions on leased lines as large organisations do now.
You also get cheap internet phone calls, faster downloads and so forth. For people it's nice. For the country, it's essential.Agree (2) Alert moderator
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GrahamA:
30 Jul 2010 9:31:34am
What I'd like to see is an understandable and non-patronising explanation of the benefits to most of us other than just big business and "keeping up with the (international) Joneses".
All I see for me is the opportunity to view movies online and similar vaccuous passtimes.
If huge benfits is really there, why hasn't commercial opportunity seen private enterprise emulate this massive plan.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Robert:
30 Jul 2010 9:34:50am
"by why do you want it, what will it achieve"
I remmber hearing these same comments in regards to medicare and superannuation....I guess some people/parties will always be locked in the past.... looking backwards perhaps.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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TheDawg:
30 Jul 2010 9:36:56am
As a business owner in Australia who trades futures contracts real time in the US, I dont need a faster internet speed.
This government are pathetically stupid. Broadband is not nation building. Building some viable industries on the otherhand would be.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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lukemac:
30 Jul 2010 9:40:34am
Its an important piece of infrastructure that needs to be built.
However I do not trust Labor to build it without major cost over runs.
Labors history over the last three years shows they cant be trusted to do anything with out the costs spirlling out of control. The computer in schools progarm was suppose to cost 1 billion and ended up costing two billion and so on and so on......Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Wake up Australia:
30 Jul 2010 9:44:16am
A very stupid way for people just to download movies and games and overall it will be a giant waste of taxpayers money - particularly at a time that should dictate constraint of government expenditure and repayment of the debt mountain created by the Gillard/Rudd Labor government. There are altenative cheaper technologies and what is proposed is far from 'future proof'. If there really is a need/demand for this service based on a cost/benefit analysis then private enterprise should provide it, not government. As far as I know the public has not seen any cost/benefit analysis from the government - maybe they think that spending $43bn (probably double) just doesn't need much analysis and of course for Gillard and co. its all about the gesture and hang the cost.
Agree (1) Alert moderator
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pseudowyre:
30 Jul 2010 9:48:34am
honestly i think this is good but the plan is bad.
we should spend 4-5Bn on a 5 city metro FTTN upgrade to allow a uniform 24Mbps to 100% of metro homes. In addition, medium to large businees should be pushed to direct fibre.
A remainder 5-10Bn should be invested in FTTP and wireless technology to regional and rural australia.
A 5 year plan for this is ideal, while FTTN in cities should be completed in much less than 5.
From a 10-20 year period 5 city metro FTTN would be upgraded to FTTP PON or direct fibre, depending on suitability.
Telstra should hand over its reginal and rural infrastructure to the government in exchange for release of USO for this regional/rural and ability to build FTTN. It would then sell of its metro network for the final phase of the FTTP build in the cities.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Kid Eager:
30 Jul 2010 9:49:16am
The story that 300 000 more premises will be announced apparently needs to be negated by an opinion masquerading as a headline that it will cost too much.
This negating tactic is typical of the apparent editorial policy of ABC News online. It does stagger me why Tony Abbott is seen as such a desirable PM. Perhaps the Liberals in some cases, but the Abbott, Joyce, Bishop shower?Agree (0) Alert moderator
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OzAz:
30 Jul 2010 9:50:28am
To all the NBN detractors I ask you one question: Do you currently have fixed cable broadband?
If your answer to this; especially if you are on some sort of fixed line, low latency, 10Mbps+ system, then you can **** (politely keep quiet). Until you have had to put up with lack of broadband like I and many others have then I consider you totally unqualified to complain about the government spending money to fix the rotten system we currently have.
As someone who lives in a very large non-capital city I (and many many others) do not have any fixed line broadband. Cable is virtually non-existent to residential homes, ADSL2 coverage in some areas is less than 50%, and there are many areas where ADSL of any kind is non-existent (about 200 out of 300 on my exchange get NO ADSL at all). We are left with two choices satellite or wireless. Wireless is generally maxed out at about 1Mbps and due to congestion on the towers suffers from occasional random drop-outs. Couple that with very high latency means current wireless systems are totally inadequate for a lot of uses people with a consistent 10Mbps+ ADSL2 connection take for granted.
Additionally do not complain about the cost, I currently pay $40/month for (ostensibly) 1.5Mbps with a 5Gb download limit / month and that's about as cheap as you'll get wireless.
Private concerns are NEVER going to fix this (I've been told to my face by a Telstra representative that they may never fix the lines in my area and they are even undecided about installing NextG) so unfortunately the government needs to step in and do it. If Labor promise to provide me with 100Mbps FTTH then they are very likely to get my vote.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Overhead:
30 Jul 2010 9:54:06am
Most of the comments so far are only concerned with household use. This is only a secondary consideration.
Industry, Commerce, Hospitals, Medical Services and Regional Areas are crying out for a 21st century Communications System. This is the 21st century! It must be rolled out.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Stephen Read:
30 Jul 2010 9:57:41am
Who is Malcolm McKenzie and what makes him an expert on the costing of such project has he a history of managing such large project.
I believe this project is crucial to the future of Australia, it sounds as if Mr McKenzie wrote the comments that opposition is wheeling out.
Lets us have comments from experts who we all know well and let them give an unbiased opinion of the project.Agree (2) Alert moderator
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76 needed to form government
State of the Parties
76 seats required for victory
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93.1% counted.
Updated Fri Sep 10 03:32AM
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||||||
| Party | % Vote | Swing | Won | Predict | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Labor | 38.0 | -5.4 | 72 | |||
| Coalition | 43.7 | +1.5 | 73 | |||
| Greens | 11.7 | +4.0 | 1 | |||
| Others | 6.6 | -0.1 | 4 | |||
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